Friday Insider: Do refs really hate Penguins?

Good stuff!

dsglass74, You completely confirm exactly what I've always known and seen from working with referees. As they move up the ranks, impartiality becomes almost an obsession. But, when a player gets a reputation, especially for being dirty and sneaky, refs are watching that player more, because they know that guy is trying hard to get away with everything he can, while the players who have reputations for being the best sportsmen, get the benefit of the doubt, because any infraction they may commit is likely to be accidental. The same goes for players who argue every call or non-call. It becomes a "cry wolf" situation, so refs just start to tune player complaints out even more. The refs are doing their best to be impartial.

I have 15 years of officiating experience; almost half of them at the collegiate level. I say that only to provide perspective and nothing more.

No matter what sport you work, and no matter what level you work, you will pre-game with your partners that night regarding all sorts of things: new rules and interpretations from the league; what type of game to expect (fast-paced, high scoring, defensive, etc.); and, always always always, the demeanor of the teams and potential problem players. This is NOT to screw over or turn a blind eye to certain players. It is an official's responsibility to have his/her radar up at all times for anything that could happen, and having a pre-game awareness about tendencies, known knuckleheads, and attitudes does nothing more than help the officials officiate the game a the highest level possible.....and even more importantly...fairly. I can guarantee you that every official in the NHL has this conversation about Downie, maybe Crosby, and the Pens in general every night. Just as NBA officials would talk about Rasheed Wallace or Dennis Rodman every night. They HAVE to be on your radar, or problems will happen.

By no means, however, is that explanation to mean that officials should either look for infractions by those players/teams, or fail to penalize infractions that occur against them. Moreover, with everything on video these days, I can tell you that nothing hurts an official more than to miss a call like the elbow to Downie's head. I can guarantee those guys were kicking themselves after seeing the video of the game.

+1 tpapp44

I've modified the wording. Spaling has used both terms when we've discussed it, but this avoids confusion.

I agree, I thought it was cool information as well!

Excellent!

I highly doubt that.

It is a good bet that, putting it mildly, the Pirates are "disappointed" in the lack of professionalism that El Toro is showing.

A true professional does not pout about a position change especially when he is the player on the down side of the wins above replacement stat. Instead, he thanks the organization that they are still willing to give him a chance at another position. By not showing up at minicamp not to mention passing on winter ball, Alvarez is snubbing the Pirates and giving them no reason to approach him with any offer whatsoever.

That really had nothing to do with this, Dom. As I wrote above, I genuinely believe the on-ice officials didn't see the play.

Looking at the replay at least 3 officials were in the zone with the 4th just outside or straddling the blue line. One, possibly two officials had players in the way obstructing their view, maybe, but all FOUR? On a play with the puck right there and in the middle of the slot? Sorry, that's just too much to accept.

I really don't hold to some theory that the refs are actively conspiring against the Pens, but this is far from the first blatant noncall we've seen, and many if not most of those have been on home ice. Some sort of subconscious bias to level the playing field with all the Pens skill players is about as far as Im willing to go. I dont know really what it is, but as someone else said where there's smoke there's fire, and there has definitely been smoke.

Finally, it's not like almost every other team doesn't have some sort of agitator like Downie and I don't think anyone can claim he's been running around playing out of control all year, that's simply not the case. I also see plenty of other players yell at and rip the officials (and coaches, watch Claude Julien just about any given game). Just last week John Tavares chewed the ref so aggressively on the way to the box (not a Pens game) I thought for sure he'd get an additional unsportsmanlike. I don't see Sid ever taking it nearly that far. I don't know, it's truly baffling, but something sure seems askew.

All that said, and sorry for the long previous post, but really the only thing the players can do is play hard between the whistles and keep their mouths shut, even if they feel they got jobbed. I don't think on-ice or post game complaints ever earn a team any favors, not that I've seen anyway.

"Looking at the replay at least 3 officials were in the zone with the 4th just outside or straddling the blue line. One, possibly two officials had players in the way obstructing their view, maybe, but all FOUR? On a play with the puck right there and in the middle of the slot? Sorry, that's just too much to accept."

But the two referees - one in the zone, one at center - were both screened on the play. They are the two who can call a penalty there. The two linesmen can NOT have the referee call a penalty there unless they determine that it's a major or match penalty (there are other penalties they can report, but none that apply there).

Can't call what you don't see. I was watching live, and I didn't see it, either.

There's a replay angle that shows the two referees, Downie and Suter were almost perfectly in line with each other. Downie screen the referee in the corner, and Suter screened the referee at center. Neither of them could have seen the elbow. Had either ref been on the other side of the ice at the time (putting the ref in the corner near 119), it would have provided a clear view of the elbow. But you can't be everywhere.

Watching on TV and officiating a game are two different worlds.

Unless you are a Little League Mom or Dad. Then its the same. And the world is black and white too. :)

More Paul Stewart gold! He admits in this article that he did not like Eric Lindros, and while he did not "invent" penalties for him, he never gave him a break on borderline calls: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/paul-stewart/hecklers-hooligans-and-th_b_5591462.html

Loved this story!

Emoneypitt, that was a good post about the Vandy workouts. As I type this out, I'm about to head out the door to gym. By no means am I personal trainer or professional fitness guru. But IMO, just because you see someone exercise and they aren't fat, doesn't mean they are healthy and "in shape". People fake fitness, trust me....never known Pedro to be media savvy, yet there is nice big picture of him doing polymeric with a band....I guess my point is we don't know how long Pedro was at Vanderbilt working out and we don't know how involved those workouts were....I just don't buy it and would have preferred him playing 1st base in winter ball and then flying to Florida to mini camp, all the while running 25 miles a week on a high protein diet...hope he proves me wrong.

emoneypitt: "Quite a number of other regulars" are NOT moving to a new position and didn't have a horrendous season both offensively and defensively last year. Don't care what kind of shape Petey is keeping himself in, this mini-camp snub just looks really bad.

Sorry, all. I just dont care about Pedro not showing up for mini-camp. He's either going to hit or he's out of a job. Whatever he does in January doesn't really matter. I wish his employers saw it that way but it's very obvious that the team and the player have an extreme Love-Hate relationship going.

1st base is where poor defenders end up because it's the easiest (hence where every DH plays during interleague). I'm not worried about that part of Pedro's game.

jordan, have you ever considered that its not just a Jan minicamp the guy doesnt give a damn about? That its pretty much from Oct-Mar that doesnt matter and the other 20 hrs a day during the season hes not playing ball?

I dont understand. Everybody likes the articles where you hear about Russell Martin busting his ass. Be nice to have an article that says "PEDRO GOES TO WINTER BALL" " PEDRO DOES CROSSFIT EATS PALEO IN OFFSEASON" or "PEDRO ATTENDS MINICAMP"

Maybe if he had done those things his ass wouldnt have gotten benched for Harrison and then moved to first.

Consistent hard work and Pedro Alvarez dont belong in the same sentence.

bpn, yes I did consider that. I just don't agree with your opinion. If you want to criticize the guy for what he does in January, have at it. You're not the only one. But I'm not doing it. He's a baseball player and it's January. This is all a big "yawn" to me.

That's about 5 January's he didn't give a damn, from my count. Not to mention skipping winter ball a few times.

Again, Pedro Alvarez has a work ethic issue. He doesn't work on his craft.

bpn, how can you possibly know if he doesnt work on his craft? you read the recent article how he works out at Vanderbilt, right? When he got to Pittsburgh, there were multiple stories heralding his work ethic. Here are 2.

http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/pirates/2008/08/17/Alvarez-s-professional-life-to-start-in-Florida/stories/200808170258

http://blackandgoldworld.blogspot.com/2009/02/alvarezs-power-work-ethic-thrill.html

I'm not going to keep arguing this, but this work ethic argument is getting old. The Pirates, known for controlling their players (remember the whole pitch count debacle in the minors?), gripe every time Alvarez snubs them in favor of his own approach. Fine. They pay his salary and have a right to be upset. But to say he doesn't care and doesn't work on his craft is laughable.

Well if it's not work ethic, than it must be talent.

Well if it's not work ethic, than it must be talent.

bpn, now I'm starting to get on your page. I think the talent is in there, I'm just not sure Pedro will ever put it all together. I can go on and on dissecting his game/swing, but bottom line is he needs to hit. Fingers crossed. Last chance really.

On that note, please dont mistake my comments as faulting people for being nervous about the first base situation. It's definitely a huge question mark heading into the season.

It would be foolish of Pedro not to care. He's in what should be the prime of his career and if he's able to turn it around, score a big contract. I'm just hoping that he treats this year like a lot of players treat a free agent year and has a huge season so that he can be sold high. If and when he scores that big contract, it's certainly not going to be in Pittsburgh. So try to get the most for him as possible. Hopefully he will help out in that regard.

That's fantastic. Fun to see him with Catherine O'Hara, too. One of my all-time favorite John Candy scenes is when he introduces himself to her as a member of the Kenosha Kickers in Home Alone.